Subj : Ukraine Redux To : alexander koryagin From : Lee Lofaso Date : Tue Oct 27 2015 20:27:24 Hello Alexander, ak> NS>> dream of of your place in history as the creator of this Eurasian NS>> Union. NS>> And an independent sovereign Ukraine with a government you can deal NS>> with is the key. For the core around which the Eurasian Union has NS>> to be built, is the very same core whose disintegration doomed the NS>> Soviet Union -- Russia, Belarus, Kazakhstan, and Ukraine. Alone, NS>> these four states, would already be the core of a Eurasian Union. NS>> But if the globalized American dominated west swallows Ukraine it NS>> can never be. ak> .. with a government, but with the government that is democratically ak> elected and is supported by all the Ukrainian people, not only one part. ak> Only blind cannot see that Ukraine has been split in two parts for a ak> long time. This split has a long history. If you are interested who ak> burned the USSR civilians in WWII on the lands occupied by fascists you ak> will know that those people were not Germans, but they were western ak> Ukrainians who served as Nazi police. In short, two parts of Ukraine are ak> divided by hatred, and democracy and elections _were_ the only thing to ak> keep them together as a state. When the results of elections were ak> tramped by the Kiev's events in 2014 it became clear that the only way ak> available for such an Ukraine is not a building of a strong single ak> state, but a war. Those Americans (senator Mc Cain - you are the first!) ak> who inspired Ukrainian people to overthrow the elected President and ak> Government are actually responsible for the blood that flows there now. Partitions have never worked. In any area of the world. At no time in history. The division in Vietnam did not last. The division in Korea will one day come to an end. The division in Palestine will also come to an end at some point in time. India and Pakistan will not be divided forever over Kashmir (although Muslims and Hindus will remain divided forever). Ireland and Northern Ireland will one day rejoin as one. Yet we see the possible partition of not only Ukraine, but also Syria, taking place. What is happening, and why is it happening? NS>> You're Vladimir Putin and you cannot allow Ukraine to join either NS>> NATO or the European Union. And you won't. The military force you NS>> have assembled on its eastern borders is the stick. But once there NS>> is a Ukrainian government you can deal with, you have an even NS>> mightier carrot to wield. ak> It's is provocative and mean to compare Ukraine with an animal that is ak> directed by Russia with a carrot. The main concern of Russia is millions ak> of (Russian) Ukrainians that do not support the things that happened in ak> Kiev in the spring of 2014. Actually when President Yanukovich was ak> overthrown by the crowd in Kiev, these people were robbed of their ak> choice and their right to choose their destiny. The people want peace, not war. For decades the people of Ukraine were at peace with both themselves and their neighbors. What happened? How did the people of Ukraine suddenly find themselves at odds with not just themselves, but everybody else as well? NS>> Let the European Union and its Troika strong-arm banking enforcers NS>> lay their severe economic demands on the table so that all the NS>> Ukrainian people understand that their "austerity" will mean NS>> poverty and hardship in the service of their "fiscal NS>> responsibility." ak> Ukrainians see it now. The facking psychopaths that captured the power, ak> like rabid germs, have actually dismantled the Ukrainian economy and the ak> balance between two parts of Ukrainians. And in addition they created a ak> bloody wall that has made the things much more difficult to solve. It is an oil war. That is the only explanation I can come up with that makes any modicum of sense. How can a people who had done fine for decades suddenly opt for war when war was never necessary? NS>> And then you offer your alternative. If Ukraine joins the Eurasian NS>> Union, Russia will not merely lend it the money to carry its debt NS>> in return for austerity. It will wipe out the debt entire by NS>> purchasing the Crimea from Ukraine. You're Vladimir Putin. With the NS>> stakes this high you can afford to do it. ak> The problem is not is Crimea, the problem is in the inhabitant of the ak> Crimea. The West must understand that it is a propaganda lie that those ak> people had voted for separation from Ukraine under Russia's threats and ak> gun barrels. The West must understand that even the bitter truth is ak> better than a lie. The West must understand what the Crimean population ak> really think about the situation on the peninsula. Then it will stop ak> save these people from themselves. I do not know, and can only venture to guess, but the population of Crimea (before any vote was taken) was probably 90% to 95% Russian speakers. Am I right? I'm willing to bet I am not far off. Language defines a culture of a people. I know this being Cajun. It is not about race or nationality. Society and culture are two different things. NS>> You're Vladimir Putin, formerly of the KGB. You're Vladimir Putin, NS>> and if you've learned nothing else there, you've learned how to NS>> make an offer that can't be refused. ak> If the US thinks that Ukrainian should join the West they should give ak> the same right to the second part of Ukraine, which wants another way. ak> That will be democracy. We live in 21st century, and we should accept ak> divorces rather that killing our wives when they are going to leave us. Ukraine must be allowed to be Ukraine. Nobody is boss of Ukrainians except Ukrainians themselves. As such, Ukrainians must be allowed to decide their own future. For themselves. --Lee --- MesNews/1.08.05.00-gb * Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2) .