Subj : Thank you Libertarians. To : BOB KLAHN From : Lee Lofaso Date : Wed Aug 13 2014 03:43:16 Hello Bob, BK> Libertarian is the least definable political philosophy I can BK> think of. Libertarian is the most definable political philosophy there is, properly understood. BK> It pretty much means what ever the speaker wants it to. Only by those who have no idea of what libertarian is or is all about. BK> Typically self described libertarians say the only purpose BK> of government is to protect the nation from invaders and BK> criminals. There is a difference between libertarian and anarchist. But few know, or understand, the difference. And even fewer want to know, or understand. BK> More recently some have boiled that down to preventing violent attacks. Do not attack gorilla with big stick. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. Feed the gorilla a banana. Or a coconut. Or whatever else it is hungry for. Nah. Neville Chamberlain tried that approach. Didn't work. BK> What they cannot explain is, just how does any society survive BK> when there is no government agency enforcing laws against BK> non-violent crime? How does a society survive when there is no BK> non-violent crime? The Catholic Church kept the peace with an inquisition ... BK> If snake oil salesmen have the right to sell anything with no BK> regard to honesty, when no one has to keep a contract, when BK> there are no standards of conduct other than don't hit people, BK> what kind of society can survive? A very gullible one. BK> It's even non-violent if the neighbors decide to use your front BK> lawn as the city dump, so how does a libertarian government BK> prevent that? You don't understand. God gave us free will. Libertarian is the only political philosophy that takes that truth seriously. If your neighbors are libertarian, well, just let me say I am glad I do not have to clean up the mess they leave behind. BK> Well, now we are seeing the blessings of libertarian thinking, BK> and it's expensive. The Toledo Ohio area had half a million BK> people without drinking water for three days because of algae BK> growing excessively in Lake Erie. Turns out this is a world BK> wide phenomena, and is the result of excess phosophorus in the BK> water. The excess phosophorus comes from fertilizer run off, as BK> a known cause, and fossil fuel production as a secondary, BK> suggested cause. Pollution. Global warming. Chemical and toxic waste. That is not libertarian thinking. It is natural and man-made causes, yes. But not a political philosophy. BK> Libertarian thinking says the government has no business BK> regulating fertilizer usage to reduce run off, after all, it BK> isn't a violent act. Again, you fail to understand what libertarian philosophy is, or is all about. Catholicism is essentially libertarian, and describes the "common good" as being an essential part of that libertarian philosophy. Really. It's in the Catechism of the Catholic Church. BK> Yet the cost is paid by the people downstream, and without some control that BK> cost can be fatal. Political anarchy is the abolition of control. That is something far different than libertarian. BK> So, now are we going to have to fight the libertarians when we BK> try to reduce fertilizer run off? Anarchists are a distinct possibility. Not so much libertarians. BK> Or are they going to let their beliefs just lie dormant when it's BK> inconvenient to defend them? Those are opportunists, not anarchists or libertarians. BK> Seems this is the best objection to libertarianism, at least the BK> current brand, you will find. The central concept of libertarian political philosophy is what is known as "the nonaggression principle" - no person may initiate physical force against another person. This principle can be extended to groups or nations. Kind of a loose adaptation of The Golden Rule. And who can object to that? BK> .. Libertarians don't build bridges. Members of The Heinlein Society would disagree with you. :) --Lee --- MesNews/1.08.05.00-gb * Origin: news://felten.yi.org (2:203/2) .